Tag: atheism

Debunking the Fourteen Basic Needs of a Marriage: Part 1b – Women? Goals? Who Are YOU Kidding!

March 18, 2012

By Incongruous Circumspection

In Part 1a, we witnessed Bill Gothard call a woman who does not obey her husband in everything, never questioning any decision he makes, a “fool”. He based this epithet on a woman while referencing Ephesians 5:22 – 24. Of course, I uncovered the fact that Bill was flat out lying. That passage says nothing of the sort.

Let’s continue discussing Gothard’s first Basic Need of a Husband ([A man needs a wife that is loyal and supportive]).

Gothard continues to expound on the above basic need by stating the following:

[Realize that your husband’s perspective is different than yours.]

Wow. Bill is really smart. Put two or more people together and you have differences. But let’s not give him any credit. That’s not what he means. Patriarchy (the religious philosophy that Bill Gothard bases all his materials on) and the Authority Doctrine (P/AD) requires distinct differences in men and women in order to prove that women need a man to rule them.

[A man’s goals often involve long-range achievement. Therefore, a man is willing to sacrifice short-term convenience in order to meet an important long-term goal. However, a wife’s perspective usually centers on short-term goals associated with her responsibilities in the family and home. During times of pressure, a wife should keep the “big picture” in mind. Accept difficult situations from God without giving Him a deadline to remove them]

While reading the above, did anyone think about sex? I would posit that most men have short term goals in mind when it comes to rolling around between the sheets. Well, of course, he probably wants to last a while, but that can still hardly be called “long term”. But Bill protects himself from this argument because he cleverly uses the words “often” and “usually” when referring to a man’s “goals” and a woman’s “perspective”.

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NLQ FAQ: Is No Longer Quivering an Atheist Website?

September 16, 2010

by Vyckie

I recently received an email from “Henrietta” who asked:

If I choose to get involved here, contribute etc, am I part of a Christian but anti QFP group; or an anti Christian and esp anti QFP group?

It is ironic that NLQ seems to be perceived quite differently depending on the perspective of the reader. We have several new readers who are commenting here on the blog ~ conservative, Quiverfull Christians who are convinced that NLQ is nothing but angry, pro-abortion, Feminazi Atheists. On the other hand, MoJoey at “Deep Thoughts” recently promoted NLQ with the caveat: Now granted, No Longer Quivering is a Christian site and I don’t normally pimp out the opposition but the woman who runs the site is a loving and tireless worker fighting to free others from a cult. Over at Free Jinger, someone was asking, What’s with all the bible quoting at NLQ?

Considering that No Longer Quivering was recently added to the official Atheist Blogroll ~ Henrietta asks a legitimate question!

I hope it won’t be too frustrating for readers if I don’t answer with a simple “Yes,” or “No.”

Since its beginning in March of 2009, NLQ has grown into a community ~ “a gathering place for women escaping and healing from spiritual abuse.” Most of us have spent years, even decades, twisting and contorting ourselves to fit the narrowly-defined, sharply delineated dogma of whatever particular brand of cult we were caught up in. Although we are a diverse group representing a variety of backgrounds, cultures and beliefs ~ we hold in common the shared experience of being conformed to a rigid system of thought which controlled every aspect of our lives and defined us as women and as (sub)human beings.

We’re here now, regaining our sanity, our sense of self ~ on the path of recovery from deep wounds and spiritual trauma ~ and every one of us is at a different place on that path. That makes us hard to peg ~ and indeed, we resist labels and categories ~ we want to be known for our unique perspectives ~ so it’s not uncommon for NLQ members to write in their introductions, “I am a Christian, but …” or “I believe in God, but …” or “I am an Atheist, but…” ~ this is our way of avoiding being stereotyped as though what we now believe can be labeled, neatly summarized and tied up into a nice, tidy Creedal package.

Leaving the Fold

September 7, 2010

[Note: This piece was originally posted at "Enlightened Life."]

by Jesslyn

Five years ago, we commenced our homeschooling journey. We were moderate christians, active in church and we believed in our faith wholeheartedly. My 2 oldest were very interested in the solar system and dinosaurs and we spent a great part of that year learning about those subjects. Our approach was purely scientific and secular. I had a few moments of doubt (as a christian) about what we were learning but felt confident that “exposing” them to secular science was a good thing.

As the years progressed and we traveled deeper into the homeschooling world, I was faced with some tough decisions. None of the families we knew were teaching their kids about evolution. When I questioned the literal interpretation of the bible (quietly and discreetly) I was told that we HAD to believe in creationism. We had to study the “facts” and get in line with the bible. So in my quest to belong and fit in, I did just that.

Let’s take a look at how I devolved while I languished in the christian homeschooling world.

Year One, my goals were academic excellence. I identified with the Classical educational approach and I pushed my daughter to do her best (probably too hard but that’s another post). Although I was unsure what I believed, as far as evolution was concerned, I found it perfectly acceptable to “expose” my children to all the ideas and review the facts with them. I had occasional bible verses for the children to memorize and we narrated a bible story or two throughout the first year. As far as culture and “worldliness” we were in the middle. I’d rate us as low on ”legalism”. Spongebob, Timmy Turner, spaghetti straps, bikinis and pop music were all fine with me.

Year two, we joined our local homeschool co-op. During our first year, we met other christian homeschoolers. This was an eye opening experience for me. I was introduced to the extremes of biblical fundamentalism. I honestly didn’t know what to think. On the one hand, I was glad to meet other homeschoolers and glad for my children to meet other wholesome kids but on the other hand, I was horrified at the attitude of these women and the oppressive nature of our meetings and conversations. Examples include, submission to husbands, ”managing” their homes, the evils of yellow cheese, the evils of public school children, and the general unsuitableness of just about anything you can think of and modesty, modesty, modesty.

Daughter of the Patriarchy: The Atheist

July 23, 2010

by Sierra

Willa was an atheist. A self-styled “unschooler,” she attended homeschool conventions and activities with her two children, Alexis (9) and Steven (5), and it was there that she met my mother. Willa’s husband worked in a field that I knew only abstractly as something involving computers and sales. He was a passive, taciturn man with whom I never exchanged a single word. Their children were boisterous, especially Alexis. Willa attached herself to my mother very quickly. Since Alexis was my age, we were an automatic source of play dates, which often really amounted to tea parties for our mothers. Common interests seemed to abound at first: homeschooling, books, and bargains. Both adored flea markets, and Willa’s house sagged under the evidence. But there was no escaping the fact that Willa was an atheist.

Willa quickly became a mission field for my mother and her friends. One by one, they joined my mother in the weekly tea parties and occasional trips to flea markets or homeschool fairs. Soon the “Seal Sisters,” as my father called my mother and her church friends (referring to the seven seals of the book of Revelations), had developed a little circle around Willa. How to deal with the “Willa problem” became a topic of heated debate.

Everybody’s dying to know!

November 4, 2009

by Vyckie A friend and I were talking rather excitedly about my upcoming guest appearance on the Joy Behar Show.  We were chattering away when she suddenly asked me, “How are you going to respond if Joy asks you what you believe about religion now?” Well, to tell the truth, I was stumped.  I mean, I do have an answer to that question, but the minute my friend asked me about it, my brain froze up and I couldn’t think of a thing to say.  Oh no, I thought ~ what if I get totally Full post …

I was too wiped out and overwhelmed to enjoy the fruits of my labor

November 2, 2009

by Vyckie Shortly after Angel’s first suicide attempt, I remember thinking to myself that all of my children were growing up without me ~ because I was much too worn down physically ~ plus what little energy I did have was all being zapped from me daily as I tried to make life with their overbearing, micro-managing, hyper-critical, narcissistic father as painless as possible for the children. Despite my efforts, they were all obviously beaten-down and discouraged to the point that we had become of family of zombies ~ excepting, of course, for Warren ~ Full post …

An open letter to Frank Schaeffer

October 19, 2009

Dear Frank, I am a former Christian homeschooling mother of seven who finally walked away from fundamentalism after our radical extremism drove my oldest daughter to attempt suicide ~ and I would like to help you spread your message and sell your books. In bible college, your father was my absolute hero ~ I read all of his books and was determined to study Christian apologetics until I could defend my faith as skillfully as Francis Schaeffer! However, as the years went by, fundamentalist “family values” put me in my place as a woman ~ and Full post …

Biblical sexism tops “Ten worst verses in the Bible”

October 3, 2009

I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. (1 Timothy 2:12)   by Vyckie Recently, I came across a “Ship of Fools” video which invited people to submit their nominations for the “Ten worst verses of the Bible” At first, I assumed that Ship of Fools must be an atheist website holding this “Worst Verse” contest as a way to raise awareness of some of the horrific messages contained in the pages of the Christian scriptures.  My assumption was based mainly on the website’s name Full post …